Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

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Dawtm
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Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:50 am

Ok so id figure id get the topic down here, but recently theres been a breakthrough of getting Quilava over Croconaw. The reasons for getting Quilava over Croconaw are:

-Faster animations

-Stronger single target damage

-More base speed

-Fire blast is really strong

-Safer

-Looks hella sick


but the negatives are:

-No surf so Mount battle is slower

-Lower Defenses so you have to potion more

-Fire blast can miss

-Earthquake does not much damage


-The AI acts differently towards Quilava/Thyphlosion then Croconaw/Feraligatr.

Neither are confirmed faster yet, but Croconaw has had a cozy stay. Thoughts?
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by LBlueEagle » Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:58 am

The SMALL amount of testing i have done with this can pretty much confirm that Croc/gatr has the advantage until Venus. At Venus is when Quilava shines brightest. They seem to even out towards the end but we still can not confirm for sure. Basically once i get back to Colosseum any% im going to try to get into a major test mode over the summer and get as many details as possible on it. But in my opinion Quilava is faster over the current any% Croc route, just somebody needs to complete a run with quilava any% and new Croc any% and compare.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Shenanagans » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:01 am

If Date = April 20 then Quilava is better. blaze boost too OP.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by heero_fred » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:10 am

While Blaze Fire Blast is OP as hell, it's accuracy is kind of bad

So in the end it may end up being like Jolteon X Espeon in XD, with one not being clearly superior as the other, but not having to rely on shoddy accuracy makes Espeon the "better" choice

also, Suicune% when Kappa ?

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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Shenanagans » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:21 am

yeah that sounds about right. also how good is bayleef? we should totally look into him. Kappa
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:47 am

heero_fred wrote:While Blaze Fire Blast is OP as hell, it's accuracy is kind of bad

So in the end it may end up being like Jolteon X Espeon in XD, with one not being clearly superior as the other, but not having to rely on shoddy accuracy makes Espeon the "better" choice

also, Suicune% when Kappa ?
85% isn't too bad but it certainly hurts. Its kind of one of those things that hits almost all the time but you know one time its going to miss and mess you up. qq

dont underestimate bayleef though. that high crit chance on razor leaf is deadly Kappa
Last edited by Dawtm on Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by LBlueEagle » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:50 am

Dawtm wrote:85% isn't too bad but it certainly hurts. Its kind of one of those things that hits almost all the time but you know one time its going to miss and mess you up. qq
and then the run ends because its Colosseum. Because we all know Colosseum runs can end on every trainer except Rider Willie.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by heero_fred » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:51 am

poor Rider Willie BibleThump

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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:59 am

LBlueEagle wrote:
Dawtm wrote:85% isn't too bad but it certainly hurts. Its kind of one of those things that hits almost all the time but you know one time its going to miss and mess you up. qq
and then the run ends because its Colosseum. Because we all know Colosseum runs can end on every trainer except Rider Willie.
Image
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Shenanagans » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:02 am

Dawtm wrote: Image

I bet that took you like 20 minutes of resets
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by LBlueEagle » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:03 am

Dawtm wrote:Image
how do i know you did not do that on purpose?
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Shenanagans » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:10 am

must have been a 79 sp. att espeon
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by luckytyphlosion » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:11 am

Shenanagans wrote:yeah that sounds about right. also how good is bayleef? we should totally look into him. Kappa
Well, Choice Specs Petal Dance is Good--- wait a minute Kappa.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:21 am

LBlueEagle wrote:
Dawtm wrote:Image
how do i know you did not do that on purpose?
I-i didnt I p-promise. HassanChop I wonder how Suicune compares to Thyphlosion in terms of speed. Id imagine Suicune would be faster but Im not sure if it would be all that much faster.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by LBlueEagle » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:25 am

Dawtm wrote: I wonder how Suicune compares to Thyphlosion in terms of speed. Id imagine Suicune would be faster but Im not sure if it would be all that much faster.
You would have to first ball it in order for it to be faster im pretty sure. But Suicune is the fastest and safest option
just because of its raw power, i doubt anyone will go for that run though.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:37 am

LBlueEagle wrote:
Dawtm wrote: I wonder how Suicune compares to Thyphlosion in terms of speed. Id imagine Suicune would be faster but Im not sure if it would be all that much faster.
You would have to first ball it in order for it to be faster im pretty sure. But Suicune is the fastest and safest option
just because of its raw power, i doubt anyone will go for that run though.
True, betting on a 2% chance just for one pokemon is pretty asinine. I hope someone does a segmented run with it some day
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Thu Apr 24, 2014 11:27 pm

Ok, so with some testing you can buy 2 calcium instead of 3 at agate 1. which is a free 9800 to spend on full restores early on which would help. All it does is make the Vileplume damage range slightly harder to hit
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by jolteontrainer » Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:07 am

Dawtm wrote: Image
How the fuck.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by LBlueEagle » Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:42 am

jolteontrainer wrote:How the fuck.
He basically either helping hand/called or or double called until they got tackled to death. Its not actually possible unless someone doesnt know how to pokemon
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by heero_fred » Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:51 am

LBlueEagle wrote:
jolteontrainer wrote:How the fuck.
He basically either helping hand/called or or double called until they got tackled to death. Its not actually possible unless someone doesnt know how to pokemon
I do wonder how many turns it took

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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by LBlueEagle » Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:52 am

heero_fred wrote:I do wonder how many turns it took
Same considering those things can growl and tail whip who knows.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:09 am

heero_fred wrote:
LBlueEagle wrote:
jolteontrainer wrote:How the fuck.
He basically either helping hand/called or or double called until they got tackled to death. Its not actually possible unless someone doesnt know how to pokemon
I do wonder how many turns it took
It took 7 turns, i just bit espeon and returned umbreon. luckily they used tail whip so it went fast.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by jolteontrainer » Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:09 pm

But uh yeah, in Blue's stream, he mentioned that the AI acted "weird" with Bayleaf strats. Possible run? Very interested to test it out.
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by Dawtm » Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:50 pm

jolteontrainer wrote:But uh yeah, in Blue's stream, he mentioned that the AI acted "weird" with Bayleaf strats. Possible run? Very interested to test it out.
From what he said the AI practically ignores bayleef, Unless it can kill bayleef they wont attack it assume. The AI usually goes ballistic if it cant kill a pokemon or do a gimmick and since bayleef is tanky im sure the AI would cry. With that said you probably wont get far late game because it does around 0 damage i would assume
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Re: Quilava vs Croconaw as the 2nd Primary pokemon

Post by jolteontrainer » Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:38 pm

Dawtm wrote:The AI usually goes ballistic if it cant kill a pokemon or do a gimmick and since bayleef is tanky im sure the AI would cry.
Sounds good until the last 5 fights. Especially the last fight and Evice is already a shitty fight.
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