Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

starcrytas
Bug Catcher
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:32 am

Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by starcrytas » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:28 am

Hi everyone

In the links below, I streamed my Pokemon Emerald run. It happens to be the world record. Unfortunately, part of the run was lost. Everything from Phoebe's Banette KO to Drake's Kingdra before it got KO'd was lost due to a glitch in the stream.

The reason for this post is that I streamed a run, which happened to end as the new world record, and want the communities thoughts on it.

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/50534803
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/50539290

anirocks99
Schoolkid
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:27 am
Location: California, United States

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by anirocks99 » Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:19 am

Well Star, this came completely out of nowhere, having a first look at it, it seems somewhat legit, however, how can you prove that the "glitch" was as a result of the stream and not of cheating. If you can tell us that, then I can attest that this may truly be the new record OneHand

starcrytas
Bug Catcher
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:32 am

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by starcrytas » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:07 am

anirocks99 wrote:how can you prove that the "glitch" was as a result of the stream and not of cheating. If you can tell us that, then I can attest that this may truly be the new record OneHand
Can't really say because it wasn't my control. I guess if you look at the timer at the bottom. During the down time, I missed the range on Walrien in E4 #3, and did everything else like normal, which is equip the persim berry and heal Rayquaza.

anirocks99
Schoolkid
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:27 am
Location: California, United States

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by anirocks99 » Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:46 am

All right Star, I have nothing more to add, go ahead and add the time if you haven't already. Howeer, when more people begin to address this, you need to have a valid answer for all of them like Exarion otherwise all of your runs will possibly be DQ'd for both Emerald and Rumble and perhaps no time of yours will be accepted. But at a first glance, I can't blatingly see any evidence of cheating, but just like last time, some random people who I'm pretty sure don't run the game show up calling out "early abra" or "crit hacks" just to take your time away. Last time seemed cheated, but this looks legit as far as I'm concerned TriHard

User avatar
Amoeba
Cooltrainer
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:26 am
Contact:

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Amoeba » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:20 am

Well this is interesting. I've actually already seen this run, as it was pointed out to me by someone who found it.

A couple of things initially strike me as suspicious, specifically that it was done on emulator, when you have streams recorded on console, the emulator used is vba-rr (an emulator that makes recording and playing back segmented/spliced runs stupidly easy), and despite the clearness and volume of your mic I never hear any button presses. However despite all this, there's nothing convincingly damning about the recording (that I found), and the quality of your play and knowledge demonstrated is really good.

So congrats on the world record, its a nice run~
~

Darcovian
Schoolkid
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:39 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Darcovian » Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:54 am


Complete Edit

Gonna rephrase what I said as it seemed much more aggressive than I intented
but yeah
starcrytas wrote: If that kind of BS is accepted, I'm not going to submit ANY runs to PSR, and remove my Rumble time even if I'm legit by PSR standards.
I thought you mentioned before that you didn't want to submit your runs and were removing your times? What made you change your mind?

Correct me if im wrong, but I thought VBA-M was the only emulator that was accepted for emulation? If not thats great I cant stand VBA ><

starcrytas
Bug Catcher
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:32 am

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by starcrytas » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:15 pm

Darcovian wrote:
Complete Edit

Gonna rephrase what I said as it seemed much more aggressive than I intented
but yeah
starcrytas wrote: If that kind of BS is accepted, I'm not going to submit ANY runs to PSR, and remove my Rumble time even if I'm legit by PSR standards.
I thought you mentioned before that you didn't want to submit your runs and were removing your times? What made you change your mind?
That was for the Sapphire run issue. I agree with the Sapphire community. Enough said; let's not go there again.
Darcovian wrote:Correct me if im wrong, but I thought VBA-M was the only emulator that was accepted for emulation? If not thats great I cant stand VBA ><
VBA-rr was used to get a recording of the run in the background just in case the entire stream (or part of the stream in this case) went out. I am converting it to .AVI and uploading to Youtube, but keep in mind that the files are 1GB+ and it takes me a LONG time to upload a 1GB+ video to Youtube. Also, it'd be like Werster's local recording of his Emerald PB where a timer isn't shown, but I will commentate over my run and explain what's going on like Exarion's 1:50 Red run.

Darcovian
Schoolkid
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:39 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Darcovian » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:56 pm

starcrytas wrote: VBA-rr was used to get a recording of the run in the background just in case the entire stream (or part of the stream in this case) went out. I am converting it to .AVI and uploading to Youtube, but keep in mind that the files are 1GB+ and it takes me a LONG time to upload a 1GB+ video to Youtube. Also, it'd be like Werster's local recording of his Emerald PB where a timer isn't shown, but I will commentate over my run and explain what's going on like Exarion's 1:50 Red run.
You can do that with all versions of VBA but thats besides the point. I have no issue with that but does that mean we aren't confined to VBA-M if so I will be purging that from my computer the first chance I get I cannot stand VBA.
starcrytas wrote:That was for the Sapphire run issue. I agree with the Sapphire community. Enough said; let's not go there again.
Thats not what I mean and I can't think of a way to phrase so it doesn't sound like im being aggressive(which believe me isn't my intention) so Ill leave that there.

starcrytas
Bug Catcher
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:32 am

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by starcrytas » Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:50 pm

Darcovian wrote:
starcrytas wrote: VBA-rr was used to get a recording of the run in the background just in case the entire stream (or part of the stream in this case) went out. I am converting it to .AVI and uploading to Youtube, but keep in mind that the files are 1GB+ and it takes me a LONG time to upload a 1GB+ video to Youtube. Also, it'd be like Werster's local recording of his Emerald PB where a timer isn't shown, but I will commentate over my run and explain what's going on like Exarion's 1:50 Red run.
You can do that with all versions of VBA but thats besides the point. I have no issue with that but does that mean we aren't confined to VBA-M if so I will be purging that from my computer the first chance I get I cannot stand VBA.
I didn't know you could do that. I assumed rerecording meant that it was the only VBA emulator that can record.

User avatar
Tigerkyle
Bug Catcher
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:59 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Tigerkyle » Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:09 pm

Also, if you're playing this on emulator, why are you using a camera to record?

starcrytas
Bug Catcher
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:32 am

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by starcrytas » Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:20 pm

Tigerkyle wrote:Also, if you're playing this on emulator, why are you using a camera to record?
The camera was my tablet to stream live on Ustream. My computer sucks for Twitch streaming so the Ustream alternative is the best I can do.

User avatar
Zewing
Youngster
Posts: 62
Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 6:30 pm
Location: United States of America

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Zewing » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:05 pm

Why couldn't you stream to twitch? What were the reasons?

Meant to quote what you said, but I read your post. Just like what technical reasons are there as I've only ever streamed to twitch.
Is Pokemon an RPG?

Scizory
Preschooler
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:27 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Scizory » Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:19 pm

@zewing Someone told me that he said twitch would be too mainstream to stream on...
and btw i dont believe that this run is actually legit:
- you used a different emulator than everyone else
- 1 part is missing
- you never stream attempts
- you already attracted negative attention with your crystal run
- you are not nicknaming your slaves
- as moobs said: no controller sound
etc...

well i dont want to be that offensive but you have to know that it's only natural to react like this if a WR comes out of nowhere under these weird conditions ..

PS: could you please post a screen of your computer specs?
KevinTurtle

Darcovian
Schoolkid
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:39 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Darcovian » Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:10 pm

Scizory wrote:@zewing He said that twitch would be too mainstream to stream on...
and btw i dont believe that this run is actually legit:
- you used a different emulator than everyone else
- 1 part is missing
- you never stream attempts
- you already attracted negative attention with your crystal run
- you are not nicknaming your slaves
- as moobs said: no controller sound
etc...

well i dont want to be that offensive but you have to know that it's only natural to react like this if a WR comes out of nowhere under these weird conditions ..

PS: could you please post a screen of your computer specs?
Okay so two things I just want to make clear
The part that is missing is a part that is not of a great amount of significance + as well starcrytas mentioned that he has the local recording as well so he is uploading that to youtube. Therefore we will see that part of the run.

Secondly, not nicknaming slaves is common I don't nickname them and every runner I've watched doesn't nickname them bar from castform and RayQ

Also I don't believe that we should scrutinize based on previous reputation at this point. It is a basis of suspicion that brings about the discussion on the run however I don't think its fair to damn someone because of the reputation. To put it in simpler terms, we need to analyze this as if the world record was run by some any random person to avoid getting to the point of "this is fake because you are a cheater" arguments.

EDIT

but the two points that I do agree with you about though are involving the no button presses and the different emulator however, if that emulator is allowed to be used then I see no issue that he used something different than anyone else.

Exarion
Cooltrainer
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2014 10:07 am

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Exarion » Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:48 pm

Darcovian wrote:Also I don't believe that we should scrutinize based on previous reputation at this point. It is a basis of suspicion that brings about the discussion on the run however I don't think its fair to damn someone because of the reputation. To put it in simpler terms, we need to analyze this as if the world record was run by some any random person to avoid getting to the point of "this is fake because you are a cheater" arguments.
Emulated runs can easily be cheated, so relying on the run itself is insufficient. Almost anyone could hack an emulator or carefully splice a run (streamed or not) and then get WR. A person with a history of cheating, lying about cheating, and other suspicious activity (including runs of this game and Crystal that were rejected) should not be given the benefit of the doubt, regardless of how legit the run seems. If the run is legit, the runner should be able to prove it; until then, there's no reason to accept it.
Twitch channel: http://www.twitch.tv/exarionu
Pokemon Red speedrunning guide: http://pastebin.com/CkVA5yvJ

Scizory
Preschooler
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:27 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Scizory » Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:09 pm

^ what exarion said and also: I just want to see him doing attempts.. I'm very crucial if it comes to these kinds of runs or maybe i'm just prejudiced from his crystal run but yeah if it turns out that his run is actually legit i really want to apologize but as long as its not confirmed legit I will stay that crucial because a WR Video should be impeccable since its a huge achievement and moobs worked hard for his run with improving the route and streaming lots of attempts
KevinTurtle

User avatar
Amoeba
Cooltrainer
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:26 am
Contact:

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Amoeba » Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:21 pm

Just a quick one to Scizory, him not naming the slaves isn't significant, it is actually faster to not nickname them. I don't name them.

However, as someone pointed out to me earlier (I won't name them in case they don't want me to) check out the first-part recording, at 20:10 ish. As he runs past the lady rotato, the music skips a beat, at the exact point where he needs to start walking to manipulate the spinner. This really looks like a save state being loaded, to me.
~

Scizory
Preschooler
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:27 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Scizory » Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:35 pm

haha i didnt know that :D well that gives me a free time save for improving my 2:54:25 KevinTurtle
KevinTurtle

Izraill
Preschooler
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri May 02, 2014 6:56 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Izraill » Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:39 pm

Amoeba wrote: However, as someone pointed out to me earlier (I won't name them in case they don't want me to) check out the first-part recording, at 20:10 ish. As he runs past the lady rotato, the music skips a beat, at the exact point where he needs to start walking to manipulate the spinner. This really looks like a save state being loaded, to me.
That's a very valid point, but that doesn't necessarily meant it's cheated. I haven't carefully listened to the music on the full run yet so I don't know if the audio problems happen again, but I have experienced similar audio issues just from emulator lag when I play the game with several other programs open (hosting skype calls, other games open, playing videos, music, etc.). If Starcrytas' computer is really so poor that he can't even do low bitrate low res stream to twitch, he may have a legit reason for the music skipping a beat.

starcrytas
Bug Catcher
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:32 am

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by starcrytas » Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:46 pm

@Zewing
My computer sucks for Twitch streaming. It's choppy and terrible quality.

@Scizory
I streamed some Emerald. No one watches them. I don't think controller sounds is a reason to ban a run, but I get where you're coming from.

@Darcovian
I'm going to compare VBA rr with VBA-M to check accuracy. If VBA rr is inaccurate, then my run will be rejected.

@Exarion and Scizory
I have streamed many resets and failed runs to Abra and unlucky crits.

@Amoeba
The emulator runs at different speeds at times and/or lags at times. The local recording should not have that.

User avatar
G_heinz
Pokémon Trainer
Posts: 133
Joined: Tue May 13, 2014 8:27 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by G_heinz » Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:34 pm

i didn't watch the run, don't know anything about emerald that isn't ripped straight from sapphire, and am going to refrain from taking sides, but i just wanted to make a note.
starcrytas wrote:@Scizory
I streamed some Emerald. No one watches them. I don't think controller sounds is a reason to ban a run, but I get where you're coming from.
^ that is not a reason or an explanation. amoeba raised a very pertinent point and you dismissed it with a red herring. in fact, if there is no controller/keyboard sound coming from a microphone that otherwise seems to be picking up every other sound (the computer, ambient noise from the room), and it is for the reason amoeba suspects it is (not an unreasonable suspicion by any means), then it definitely would be reason to ban the run.

whether or not the run is legit (and barring completely my own opinion--like i said, didn't watch it), it's these kinds of arguments that need to be confronted for what they are in the face of an otherwise completely reasonable skepticism.

User avatar
Amoeba
Cooltrainer
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:26 am
Contact:

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Amoeba » Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:47 pm

Izraill wrote:That's a very valid point, but that doesn't necessarily meant it's cheated. I haven't carefully listened to the music on the full run yet so I don't know if the audio problems happen again, but I have experienced similar audio issues just from emulator lag when I play the game with several other programs open (hosting skype calls, other games open, playing videos, music, etc.). If Starcrytas' computer is really so poor that he can't even do low bitrate low res stream to twitch, he may have a legit reason for the music skipping a beat.
Ohh I'm not saying its a concrete reason to ban it, just bringing it up. If he's right and it's just emulator lag (which I'm not sure it is, I'm fairly used to vba lag and there's no video lag with the audio lag/skip) then it wont matter, just wanted to bring something I'd noticed up.
~

Scizory
Preschooler
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:27 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Scizory » Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:59 pm

other than that: why is he always coming up with new world records and never with any new PBs ? and also since you did cheat on your previous runs why is he still able to submit times ?
KevinTurtle

Izraill
Preschooler
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri May 02, 2014 6:56 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Izraill » Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:00 pm

G_heinz wrote:
^ that is not a reason or an explanation. amoeba raised a very pertinent point and you dismissed it with a red herring. in fact, if there is no controller/keyboard sound coming from a microphone that otherwise seems to be picking up every other sound (the computer, ambient noise from the room), and it is for the reason amoeba suspects it is (not an unreasonable suspicion by any means), then it definitely would be reason to ban the run.

.

I'd like to request (if it's not an unreasonable request) that Starc shows us what kind of controller/keyboard he uses to play so we can get the 'no button sound' issue out of the way. I have experience in controllers and will know if it's reasonable or not for such controller to make so little noise. That should get at least this part of the argument out of the way.

User avatar
Tigerkyle
Bug Catcher
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2014 5:59 pm

Re: Pokemon Emerald In 2:42:31

Post by Tigerkyle » Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:10 pm

I agree with what izraill said. Also, computer specs would be nice, because i find it very hard to believe your computer would have issues streaming on twitch. I used to stream on a crappy laptop at 200 bitrate, and Amoeba streams with a pretty shitty laptop and it works for him (no offense buddy).

Locked

Return to “Pokémon Emerald”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests