Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

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Dabomstew
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Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Wed Apr 15, 2015 12:28 am

A lot of interest has been shown in attempting to hold another PSR marathon in the thread over here, so I felt like it was time to try to start organizing things for real.

Right now a lot of things are still uncertain about the marathon, but I'm looking for signups/expression of interest for two different roles right now:
  • Post if you are interested in being on the marathon organization committee. You would need to be willing to spend a decent amount of time on things like scheduling and organization, working with the other committee members to plan a successful marathon. The organization will most likely be taking place within a Skype group (with regular updates posted to the forums as appropriate), so you will need to be an active Skype user. I'm looking to establish a committee within the next few days to get some discussions going as soon as possible, so please don't delay your application too long if you're genuinely interested.
  • Update 16/04/2015: Restreamer applications are no longer required for the time being. See this post for more details. Please continue to post if you're interested in becoming part of the organizing committee, that should be formed shortly.
We also need to work out a set of dates for the marathon to take place. As RXFADEZ said in the original topic, the ideal time for this marathon to take place would probably be sometime in July or August when availability is generally higher, but we do need to watch out for other events.

If we want to arrange it around a weekend, then the weekends in July/August are July 4-5, 11-12, 18-19, 25-26 and August 1-2, 8-9, 15-16, 22-23, 29-30. SGDQ 2015 is from July 26-August 1 so those two weekends are out, but which dates would everyone else prefer? Some opinions on this would be handy, but the final decision won't be made until the organizing committee is finalized and we may well seek further opinions as part of game submissions (from within a smaller set of dates).

On that note, game submissions will be opened once the committee is established and a target length/format for the marathon is decided upon.

As a final thought, in my opinion this marathon should be a for-fun (not for-charity) marathon like the first marathon ended up being for the same reasons as were established back then (see here for a post I made on the matter). But if you disagree, feel free to argue your case for it being a charity marathon here (along with a potential choice of charity).

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Lemonian » Wed Apr 15, 2015 1:04 am

If I am needed, I'd be interested in helping you guys restream.
This will ofcourse depends on the date.

I have a good/stable internet connection at the moment.
I also know my way around OBS.

Greetings,

Lemonian!

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by xxxAceBlade » Wed Apr 15, 2015 1:24 am

I'll restream. Might not be much of a runner, but I enjoy watching and know my way around OBS :p. Can only restream on the weekend or late evening central time, but I can definitely keep a restream running on my pc for most of a weekend.
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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Gymfreak739 » Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:56 am

I'd be down for organizing and scheduling the event. Also, I'm down with dealing with a game submission form (although I assume one of the higher ups has that covered), and creating a spreadsheet for the games list + schedule once decided upon. For the dates, I think either July 11-12th (2 weeks before SGDQ) or August 15-16th (2 weeks after SGDQ) are the best.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Wed Apr 15, 2015 4:07 am

Gymfreak739 wrote:I'd be down for organizing and scheduling the event. Also, I'm down with dealing with a game submission form (although I assume one of the higher ups has that covered), and creating a spreadsheet for the games list + schedule once decided upon. For the dates, I think either July 11-12th (2 weeks before SGDQ) or August 15-16th (2 weeks after SGDQ) are the best.
I should clarify - there are no "higher ups" for this project right now except for me, and that's only because I took the initiative to make this topic. This marathon is being organized 99% separately from the PSR forum admin team or any other "official" PSR group, and the 1% remaining is just me getting help from them outside of their admin role in terms of sanity checking my forum posts and possibly helping with the overall stream setup.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Kylovic » Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:25 am

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1I4SCEK ... I/viewform

I made like a "basic" Form to fill out for game submissions for the marathon.
Idk if its that useful but it would give us an overwiev of what we´d have for the marathon ^^
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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:17 am

@Kylovic:

I don't exactly recall what the exact format of the last marathon's form was, but a couple of points:
  • Game entry should probably be freeform, not to allow non-Pokemon submissions but just in case we forget any games (TCG2 comes to mind, no matter how unlikely someone is to submit that we don't want to limit them lol)
  • Multiple game/category submission. Whilst it's a good idea to have as many unique runners as possible, we may still need some runners to cover a couple of games each to cover a good set of generations/unique games.
Other than that it seems like a good start, though I think the format for this marathon can be left up to the organization committee once it has been formed.

@ Lemonian and AceBlade

Thanks for your offers to restream, a couple more and I think we will have a real chance to get a continuous marathon going (though we're also looking into an alternative option for restreaming which wouldn't require good personal internet connections)

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Javi137 » Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:10 am

I could help with the organization of the marathon. I want to help with it, and since I cant really restream and I don't speedrun anymore that would be a nice way to participate

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Wed Apr 15, 2015 11:45 am

I'd be up for being a member of the committee. My speedrunning talents may be lacking to say the least but I feel I'd be a good addition in helping set up. Also quick question! This probably won't effect me but are we going to generally say that a member of the committee can only run a game/category if they are the only ones interested?

For example, Person A is a Red Any% Glitchless runner and on the committee and wants to run Red Any% Glitchless. Because Red Any% Glitchless is popular speedrun, more people will have submitted themselves. Providing they're available, shouldn't the non-committee submissions be placed before committee ones to avoid bias?

Sorry if this doesn't make too much sense. I was working from 4am until 11am today and haven't got much sleep. :lol:

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Darcovian » Wed Apr 15, 2015 1:39 pm

Organisation, Restreaming general Busybody I can do that any of them work for me, I have no exams and no worries then.

And in terms of Charity/fun, I would recommend we do it for fun at first, if its successful then on the next one we do then we do it for a charity. It would be great to do it for a charity but considering this is our first marathon I would say that we need a stress test before we can commit to something.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Wed Apr 15, 2015 4:05 pm

Forgive me if this is a stupid question but where would we stream it to?
I mean I know it would be Twitch but would we stream it to someone's personal channel or a PSR channel?

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Gymfreak739 » Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:22 pm

RXFADEZ wrote:I'd be up for being a member of the committee. My speedrunning talents may be lacking to say the least but I feel I'd be a good addition in helping set up. Also quick question! This probably won't effect me but are we going to generally say that a member of the committee can only run a game/category if they are the only ones interested?

For example, Person A is a Red Any% Glitchless runner and on the committee and wants to run Red Any% Glitchless. Because Red Any% Glitchless is popular speedrun, more people will have submitted themselves. Providing they're available, shouldn't the non-committee submissions be placed before committee ones to avoid bias?

Sorry if this doesn't make too much sense. I was working from 4am until 11am today and haven't got much sleep. :lol:
In my opinion, I don't think it should matter if you are part of the committee or not, just the skill of the runner. For example, let's say Exarion was part of the committee, and I was not. We both submit Red Glitchless. Even though Exarion would be part of the committee, and I am not, one of us is clearly better than the other. Same situation works vice versa too.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:41 pm

Gymfreak739 wrote: In my opinion, I don't think it should matter if you are part of the committee or not, just the skill of the runner. For example, let's say Exarion was part of the committee, and I was not. We both submit Red Glitchless. Even though Exarion would be part of the committee, and I am not, one of us is clearly better than the other. Same situation works vice versa too.
I think you've completely missed the point here.
If someone is a member of the committee and submits a run then they can just accept their own run. This is flawed as people will be biased towards their own submissions.
Joining the committee is completely optional therefore, in your hypothetical, if Exarion did want to run Red Glitchless then he doesn't need to be in the committee if he doesn't want to be.
I'm also not saying that committee member would be banned from running. There's no reason they couldn't participate in races or play games where there are no submissions or they are the only ones that know that category.
For example, if I join the committee and by the time we do the marathon I have optimised Emerald Glitched and I am the only person running it (providing Werster doesn't return to it ofc) then there's no reason why I wouldn't be allowed to run it as there's no competition for the spot and it would only add another category to the marathon.
Also, people who are already running something should be last on the list of runners for any other game to try and add some diversity to the marathon. So if in my hypothetical Werster wanted to run Glitched but was already running a different game then I would be chosen, even as a member of the committee, to keep it fair.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Wed Apr 15, 2015 9:21 pm

Kylovic wrote:https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1I4SCEK ... I/viewform

I made like a "basic" Form to fill out for game submissions for the marathon.
Idk if its that useful but it would give us an overwiev of what we´d have for the marathon ^^
Also, I've tried to make a slightly more detailed version of Kylo's form here http://goo.gl/forms/dXCk06Gs1V

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Sinstar » Wed Apr 15, 2015 10:51 pm

I'd be interested in being part of the committee since I probably don't have the internet to even submit a run for the marathon, but I'd love to help out in some way and at least actually see this go ahead this time around, hopefully we can make it happen because it would be a really fun event. Certainly I agree that it should just be for fun and not be all about donations or anything, rather promoting the community itself more.
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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Wed Apr 15, 2015 11:27 pm

One new development and my opinion on the issues you guys have been discussing:

Restreaming

Last night I worked with abitalive (a former PSR forum admin) on coming up with a better solution for restreaming that doesn't rely on people with good internet being available to restream 24/7 during the marathon, and thanks to his solid research we have come up with a solution. We can set up a temporary "restream server" on the cloud and just have people remote in to control it instead of having everyone restream from their personal internet.

The main advantage of this is that we will no longer need people with good internet connections available to be restreamers, though we will still need people on hand to manage the stream on the server ("stream mangers", I guess). This also means the stream will be continuous except for any Twitch issues, and that there shouldn't be any layout inconsistencies as everything will only need to be setup once.

With that in mind, I don't see any point in taking solid applications for stream managers until the dates for the marathon are actually set in stone, since the pool of people actually able to do the job should be vastly increased by this change. If you offered your services for the old restreaming method already, thanks for the offer but hopefully it won't be necessary - you can still apply to spend time managing the stream instead.

Runs by committee members vs non-committee members

Fadez brings up a fair point about committee member "bias", but I think Gymfreak is closer to the mark here. One of the main reasons why the committee will be made up of multiple people from different "areas" of the PSR community will be to try to have it balance itself out in terms of bias or whatnot. If a certain committee member is being biased in accepting their own submission for a category over that of a more qualified runner, then it should be obvious to the other members and they can call them out on it. Even if you become a member of the committee, you don't have any kind of absolute power over scheduling on your own. I also don't want to discourage good runners from joining the committee just because they want to run the game they're good at in the marathon, they could also have great organizational skills and it would be a shame to miss out on that.

Submission Form

As of the last one by Fadez this is getting better, but still missing fields to submit more than one game. I also don't think we need to inquire about the race thing straight away - (in my opinion) we don't want to encourage people to submit races for a ton of categories since Pokemon races are often not very entertaining to watch. Runner streaming might also be done to a private RTMP server rather than Hitbox, though Hitbox would be an easy solution as well.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by heero_fred » Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:37 am

I still have the game submission form from last attempt and you can find it here: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/18CA0ap ... M/viewform

it needs to be updated to add ORAS and maybe other games that it's missing, I hope it helps the ones working on this :)

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:03 am

Dabomstew wrote: Runs by committee members vs non-committee members

Fadez brings up a fair point about committee member "bias", but I think Gymfreak is closer to the mark here. One of the main reasons why the committee will be made up of multiple people from different "areas" of the PSR community will be to try to have it balance itself out in terms of bias or whatnot. If a certain committee member is being biased in accepting their own submission for a category over that of a more qualified runner, then it should be obvious to the other members and they can call them out on it. Even if you become a member of the committee, you don't have any kind of absolute power over scheduling on your own. I also don't want to discourage good runners from joining the committee just because they want to run the game they're good at in the marathon, they could also have great organizational skills and it would be a shame to miss out on that.
This is all very true. I guess I'm quite a cynical person, but I'm sure that everyone could generally agree on who's running what without trying to slip in bias. We should also try to get people who have perhaps worked on Marathon Strats rather than the WR holder. It's a lot different getting a good time in a single-segment format than getting one when you're being pushed to do it in a limited amount of time.
Dabomstew wrote: Submission Form

As of the last one by Fadez this is getting better, but still missing fields to submit more than one game. I also don't think we need to inquire about the race thing straight away - (in my opinion) we don't want to encourage people to submit races for a ton of categories since Pokemon races are often not very entertaining to watch. Runner streaming might also be done to a private RTMP server rather than Hitbox, though Hitbox would be an easy solution as well.
I've made a few adjustments and was just curious of your thoughts now? http://goo.gl/forms/HYAAtvRn8U

EDIT: I did all this before the post above mine was posted so I may have missed things that have been included in that one.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:14 am

This is all very true. I guess I'm quite a cynical person, but I'm sure that everyone could generally agree on who's running what without trying to slip in bias. We should also try to get people who have perhaps worked on Marathon Strats rather than the WR holder. It's a lot different getting a good time in a single-segment format than getting one when you're being pushed to do it in a limited amount of time.
Very true, but runners who work on specific race/marathon strats are fairly limited in number. That said, those who do submit will certainly have a strong chance of getting in.
(marathon submission form stuff)
Yeah this is much better than previous ones, though I'd separate game and category again if the format allows. Other than that good work!

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by werster » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:34 am

I'd be interested in being in committee

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:32 pm

Dabomstew wrote: Yeah this is much better than previous ones, though I'd separate game and category again if the format allows. Other than that good work!
OK added separate games and categories now for each category and have implemented the algorithms into the results table so we can see it all clearly.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:12 pm

Looks good. Do you mind posting a link to the results spreadsheet so we can see what it comes out as? Obviously it can be made private or copied into a new document for the actual submission process when that happens.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by RXFADEZ » Thu Apr 16, 2015 5:49 pm

The way it currently comes out comes across as complicated unless it's explained. But once we have all the correct features on the submission form I would set it up so each individual Game/Category they submit is on a separate line.

e.g.
Pokémon Red Any% Glitchless
Pokémon Blue No Save Corruption
etc

But here's how it looks currently: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Dabomstew » Sun Apr 19, 2015 1:23 am

I've just sent out a PM to all the people who were interested in joining the committee. If you're one of those people and you're reading this, check it out when you get a chance.

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Re: Potential PSR Marathon 2015 - Organization Thread #1

Post by Kylovic » Sun Apr 19, 2015 2:37 pm

Dabomstew wrote:Looks good. Do you mind posting a link to the results spreadsheet so we can see what it comes out as? Obviously it can be made private or copied into a new document for the actual submission process when that happens.
So which form are we using now? We have
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/18CA0ap ... M/viewform (The form from last year)

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/19YQLjn ... rm?c=0&w=1 (Fadez new form)

If we decide on one form we could already go ahead and spread it to start collecting runs / run submissons, so we could start creating a scheudle (I would be up for making one).
Just so we know which form to take OpieOP
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