Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

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werster
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Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by werster » Thu Dec 04, 2014 8:41 am

Didn't know exactly where to put this, figured I'd just go here.

Anyway, I wanted to get the leaderboards up on speedrun.com for the Pokemon games, but I figured it would be polite to make sure everyone around here agrees this is a good idea before going ahead with it. The site is starting to look real nice when there's actually clear communication about what the leaderboards should look like for games, and it's always been the overall idea that leaderboards should all be together on one site, so I feel like it's time to get the Pokemon series up there.

Thoughts, opinions, objections, agreestions, whatever?

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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Vulajin » Thu Dec 04, 2014 10:20 am

Given the glacial pace of improvement on this site, most likely caused by the admins being busy people with actual lives and speedrunning hobbies of their own, I think this wouldn't be a bad idea. I would like to recommend that individual games be given moderators who are connected with those games in particular, e.g. folks like Garfield and I would moderate gen 5 games. It is possible to add an arbitrary number of moderators for a given game (and maybe for a given series?), so I think we should make sure that a variety of individuals, especially experts for each gen, have access.

I would particularly like to see buy-in from the PSR staff and community before anyone moves ahead with this.

(edit) I would also like to note that we should absolutely keep the wiki in general and the forums as well. Only the leaderboards should be in scope. That site really isn't suited to any of the other stuff.

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Amoeba
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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Amoeba » Thu Dec 04, 2014 1:05 pm

Sounds good to me, though probably hold off on the ORAS leaderboard for a little bit until that whole discussion about timing is sorted.
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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Exarion » Thu Dec 04, 2014 2:38 pm

I don't know much about the site, but if it becomes (or already is) respected in the speedrunning community as a whole, I think it makes sense to have our leaderboards there.
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Dabomstew
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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Dabomstew » Thu Dec 04, 2014 6:19 pm

(this post is intended to be my own opinion, though I guess it represents the opinions of forum admin team to some extent anyway)

I agree with this idea in principle and think it should be a thing, though we need to take some time to get it right. There are a few main things to overcome to get this done, none of which seem too complex but all of which take time:
  • Moving over all the existing times. This is obviously the main one, seeing as we have quite a few different games and a lot of times posted for some of them. Combine this with linking the speedrun.com accounts for people who already have them (and linking accounts later for people who make them later) and the process gets a bit tedious, but certainly nothing that's not doable by a small group of people who are prepared to put some time in.
  • Fixing up all the existing flows on the wiki & forums to point to the speedrun.com leaderboards where appropriate. Again nothing complex at all, just needs to be done when we're 100% sure we're going ahead with this and have the leaderboards setup on the other side correctly.
  • Choice of moderation. Having leaderboards on the wiki meant each game's community could self-moderate to some degree, and I agree with Vulajin's post in that I think mods should be chosen appropriately for each game on speedrun.com to restore this status. This just requires said community members to actually make speedrun.com accounts. I'm sure a few of them already have and many more will when this goes through.
  • Also agree with Vulajin that wiki and forums are definitely not moving over, the implementations for them that speedrun.com has are useful enough for smaller games/series but not really on the scale we need right now. I think we can setup appropriate links back over to our current wiki for routes and the like, so that should be no issue.

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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Gamefandan » Thu Dec 04, 2014 6:46 pm

Being that everything worth saying on the subject has already been said I would just like to say that I can think of little to no foreseeable downsides to expanding the leaderboards to other sites. I'm not too familiar with speedrun.com so I can't speak for their community's ability to contest issues with validity in timing; so I hope that if and when the leaderboards for main series and spin-off Pokemon games are added to speedrun.com everyone will still be able to depend on these forums for discussions of timing. Other than that, I have no qualms.

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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Pac » Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:01 pm

Programmer of speedrun.com here.

Like I did for SM64 (as they had about 800 runs), I'd like to offer to write a script to import all of the runs automatically.

These leaderboards will of course be managed by yourselves - you can set moderators on the entire series or individual games, customise the functionality, and set your own policies for verification.

Also, it might interest you to know that the site makes a distinction between real time and in-game time, and I will be improving this module in an upcoming update.

If there's anything I can do to make things go more smoothly, do let me know.

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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by Keizaron » Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:28 pm

I wouldn't mind volunteering for moderating something like Crystal, Gold or Red.

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werster
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Re: Putting the leaderboards on speedrun.com

Post by werster » Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:02 am

Pac that'd be sweet, make things a lot easier if possible to do without too much trouble.

Yeah I've seen the IGT stuff on the site, ideally obviously the main series games would have that, and be able to be sorted by that as a default (I couldn't see if the default option for IGT was set in place yet, games like Metroid Zero Mission use it as a primary timer yet auto'd to Real Time for example). You did mention another update that dealt with IGT in some way, so maybe I'm just behind

Runs would also have emulator times filtered off by default I guess, still there but just without the checkbox unmarked to being (which I've already seen is possible, so that's great, and all that info is already on the leaderboards over here)

I don't think Pokemon would be at a shortage of moderators to be quite honest, I've been saying for the longest that I have wanted to put in time doing lots of grunt work for a full leaderboard site, even for the games I don't know, so moderating the Pokemon series would be no sweat at all. There's a bunch of other super obvious choices, even if you were particular enough to go by gen (mhm + eek for gen 4, garf and vula for 5, 5upa for gen 2, who doesnt know gen 1, etc)

Obviously there no reason to migrate over the wiki/forums.

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